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Why have some superhero movies underperformed at the box office? It’s not because of what some have called “superhero fatigue,” according to Superman writer/director (and DC Studios co-chief) James Gunn — it’s because audiences got bored with movies that didn’t offer anything beyond spectacle.

Speaking to NPR, Gunn said, “I don't really think there was ever superhero fatigue, but I do think there was sort of a superhero gold rush for a minute. So I think there was a moment when anything with a superhero in it was making money. You know, visual effects allowed these movies to really shine and come out and attract people's attention.”

Of course, that couldn’t last forever — and what happened with the many, many superhero movies released by multiple studios in the wake of the success of Iron Man and the first few years of the MCU was that audiences found themselves bored by the same old stuff.

“After a while, people kind of got sick — they're like […] ‘There has to be something else here for me to see this movie. There has to be something outside of just it being another superhero movie. That's not going to get me by itself.’ And a lot of bad movies came out. So, yeah, I think that now people need a reason to go to the movies.”

While Gunn is never going to name names for the “bad movies” that he’s talking about — chances are, some were made by friends, after all — it’s worth wondering how things are going to change in the next few years, especially when it comes to DC. Gunn’s already teasing what he’s thinking.

“The main thing we wanted to bring was a sort of consistency, not in terms of tone because one of the things that we want to do is all of our DC Studios projects are very different from each other,” he teased. “So we have Superman, then we have Peacemaker Season 2, which is a pretty gritty, grounded R-rated show. Then we have Lanterns, which is a very grounded HBO show. Then we have Supergirl, which is a space fantasy, then we have Clayface, which is an all-out R-rated horror movie. And, you know, I want those things to be different. But I felt like the DC characters were just sort of sold off to anyone that wanted to take them, and there was nobody really minding the mint.”

Consistency in terms of quality but diversity in terms of subject and genre? Giving audiences a reason to show up for your films and shows? It’ll never catch on. Then again, Superman did outperform box office expectations in its first weekend…

Superman is in theaters now.

James Gunn's Superman movie is out now - and we have a lot to say about it. You can also read about Superman's S-Shield through the ages, how Superman and Clark Kent keep their secret identity secret, our recs for best Superman comics, and how to watch all his TV series and movies in order.